Campus Plan Irks Residents
Neighborhood residents criticized the university for failing to consider how its proposed Campus Plan would affect the neighborhood in a community meeting Tuesday night at Georgetown Visitation Preparatory School.
The plan, which the university is required to submit every 10 years, calls for several construction projects, including expansions of Lauinger Library, McDonough Gymnasium and the Medical Center, as well as new student housing at various locations inside and outside the limits of campus.
“I think that they really haven’t listened to what we’ve been saying for the last year during this planning process,” Citizens Association of Georgetown President Jennifer Altemus (CAS ’88) said. “There was plenty of outrage last night — they saw that. And we’ll see if that gets worked into the next draft.”
Georgetown’s current campus plan, which took effect in 2000, will expire on Dec. 31, 2010. University representatives said the zoning process will take about a year. They are working with the Office of the Provost in order to draw up preliminary projections for future enrollment numbers, which will be used to draft the 2010-2020 Campus Plan.
Officials aim to use feedback from open meetings with the community to improve the model that will be presented to the D.C. Government Zoning Commission in early February. According to the university’s “Our Community” Web site, university officials will review the final draft of the Campus Plan at community meetings on Nov. 18 and 19.
Charles DeSantis, the university’s Campus Plan manager and associate vice president for benefits and chief benefits officer, began the meeting with a presentation of projections for the university’s future enrollment, as provided by the Office of the Provost. While Georgetown officials predict virtually no growth in the traditional undergraduate population by 2020, they do anticipate an increase in the graduate and non-traditional undergraduate sectors, including commuters, older students and students in the medical, MBA and certificate programs.
DeSantis said the current graduate and professional student population is 5,512, which the Office of the Provost predicts will increase to 8,700 by 2020. He said the non-traditional student population is expected to climb from 1,255 to 1,632.
“It’s actually the university’s focus … to have a broader graduate and professional program,” DeSantis said.
Many members of the community said they were concerned that the growth in the university’s graduate programs will affect traffic, parking and housing.
“Just an extra 60 students will maybe displace undergraduate students and will have a major impact on the community,” Altemus said.
Linda Greenan, associate vice president for external relations, said a major portion of the expansion will occur at the Center for Continuing and Professional Education in Arlington, Va., and on other university campuses.
Todd Olson, vice president for student affairs, said that while the majority of the graduate and continuing studies students live in the D.C. metropolitan area, the university is interested in building a housing facility for full-time graduate students. The small-scale facility would not be used to create space for further expansion; it would only be used to accommodate the anticipated growth in graduate student enrollment.
Greenan said that the university is studying where these students currently live and what effect the new Campus Plan would have on housing. Some community members strongly disapproved of any plans to build a new housing facility on the block bounded by 36th, 37th, N and Prospect Streets, as they said it would irrevocably change its character.
“We do not want to see any more residences off campus,” Altemus said.
The university officials present recognized the impact of students living off-campus and the community’s desire for more on-campus residences, but said they need funding for other initiatives that would enhance student life.
“There are other things in the plan like the expansion of the library, more student space, a multi-sport facility — so we looked at it in terms of, ‘It’s questionable if we spent the money … whether students would even consider living there,’” Greenan said.
Students who attended the meeting stressed the importance of student life as off-campus residents. The students’ presence in the neighborhood has greatly angered community members because of disturbances caused by noise, trash and parties.
Olson responded to neighbors’ concerns by highlighting programs that the university has already implemented to improve off-campus student life, including SafeRides and the establishment of Living and Learning Communities in Magis Row. He also discussed plans for creating community advisers who would live off-campus in university-rented residences in order to hold nearby students accountable for university policy violations.
Plans are also in place to double the Student Neighborhood Assistance Program, which consists of an officer who patrols West Georgetown and Burleith to break up loud parties and respond to neighbors’ noise complaints.
Community members said SNAP has been a complete failure, however. Attendees maligned the inefficiency of the program and expressed their disbelief that it has the same effect on student parties as Metropolitan Police Department officers.
Community members said they felt anger and frustration toward the university for providing little numerical data and hosting meetings that appear not to be sincere efforts to incorporate the community’s concerns into the Campus Plan.
Greenan said that after this meeting, the university plans to re-evaluate its first draft. “I think the community is pretty clear about what they want … and we’re going to go back and discuss it. … I’m not hopeful that the community is going to change,” Greenan said.
Nov 06 2009 at 2:56 p.m.
Last time I checked, none of the outraged community members moved in before 1789.
If you are going to MAKE THE CHOICE to live near Georgetown, you should expect to have students around.
Nov 06 2009 at 5:15 p.m.
Dearest 1789,
GU was formed in 1789.
Georgetown (the community) was founded in 1751.
The Indians were here prior to that.
If you MAKE THE CHOICE to live in the community of Georgetown, which is ruled under the laws and regulations of D.C., you have a choice to follow the laws or face the consequences.
Bigger point is why would students support a plan of no additional housing for 3000+ students. There is only so much off-campus housing, and Mr. Slumlord is already smiling at the increase in rent dollars coming his way. Time to think a little ye ole 1789er. Matter of fact, I could probably get about 6 students in my little place -$1500 each = $108,000 per year in rental revenue... don't worry about maintaining the property.... CANCEL THAT! Bring on the plan!!
Nov 06 2009 at 5:41 p.m.
1751: You go! That's the first time I've heard it put that way and it's a very fair argument.
Nov 06 2009 at 7:00 p.m.
If the neighborhood approached the off-campus housing issue like 1751, I think it might get some student support. The neighbors and the students should be allied in getting more University housing options and in breaking the stranglehold of slumlords who put students in horribly kept homes. The students don't want to live in a dump, and the neighbors don't like that it looks like a dump. So these are two areas where the interests actually line up. Now if the neighbors would argue those points instead of the "kids are too noisy" and "we don't like parties" points, then I think there could be a formidable student-neighbors force.
Nov 06 2009 at 7:12 p.m.
Why don't the residents save us the time and declare Georgetown a version of Colonial Williamsburg, and set a closing time of 5:00 pm where the entire college shuts down and students must disappear beyond the Beltway. Methinks that's what some of these folks secretly want.
Nov 06 2009 at 8:20 p.m.
The only thing that will ever make the neighbors happy is if Gtown just shuts down. In all my years of dealing with citizen groups, I have never met any group more hateful and slanderous than the G'town neighborhood association. The word 'evil' is not too inappropriate.
Nov 07 2009 at 1:55 p.m.
As someone who lived off campus in Georgetown, it was a great experience that on-campus life simply could not and will never be able to replicate. We did have a lot of parties but residents have to accept that as a part of living in Georgetown. I'm not saying you have to like it, but it is what it is. If you move next to the airport, you might hear some planes.
I agree that the neighborhood association can be a little ridiculous at times. Their warnings, threats, and MPD aren't half as affective as getting to know the students who live near you; that way when you hear a party going on too late you call the students and tell them they need to quiet it down. We had a neighbor who was a pastor and needed to wake up early on sundays. So we came to the agreement that we would only have parties on fridays. he was satisfied and so were we
Nov 07 2009 at 2:53 p.m.
The Neighborhood Association has legitimate claims to influence student life and the expansion of the University, but on the whole they have all too much power to do so. In the history of the University, its only been recently that even close to a majority of students have been housed on campus... watch the Exorcist, they've built at least three major housing projects since 1971, including Village A, Village B, Henle, and the Southwest Quad, and now the percentage of students living on campus is somewhere around 80%. This is a tremendous accomplishment considering the scarcity of space on campus and the financial challenges Georgetown faces.
Georgetown does not have enough space or resources to increase housing on campus, and needs to direct its resources to improving student space so that social life and student activities takes place primarily within the walls. There is a desperate need for more student space on campus, and fulfilling this need should be something that the associations of the neighborhood support because it will encourage students to stay on campus.
Nov 08 2009 at 8:29 a.m.
Let's start with Max G and work backwards:
GU's architect stated there is currently room for an additional 800 beds on campus. GU's latest plan does not incorporate that opportunity. GU made the mistake of providing too much housing on the edge or even outside the boundaries of the campus. This poor planning has resulted in GU making their problem OUR (students and community) problem. Just like the campus alcohol policy- GU couldn't deal with it so they threw it off-campus to make the students/community battle it out.
To off campus hoya alum: Residents do NOT have to accept laws or regulations being violated in their community. That is an assumption that too many have already made, and now have permanent arrest record (61Ds) because of it. It is not a good idea to encourage that behavior. Regarding the "living near an airport" comment- thank you. We all do live near an airport- DCA Airport right down the river. Have you ever noticed how the noise of the planes stop around 10-11pm and do not start up again until 6-7a.m.? That is because there are laws/regulations in place and if an airline and/or pilot violate that law the consequences start at a cool $5K plus other more serious penalties. Your last point of getting to know your neighbor/student is a stretch. Everyone that lives in the community is supposedly an adult. NO one wants to babysit their neighbor and not all of us are a pastor who is willing to put up with a party every Friday night. The reality is very few are willing to and a call to 911 will very likely occur if your neighbor chooses to violate the law. The power lies within the City laws and regulations and the enforcement of them are the MPD. Everything else is just posturing.
Alum and Dane: Come on, you can do better than this! GU is the one setting up this bad scenario. 3000 additional students and no housing?? Really, what do you think that will do to EVERYONE (except those getting the big fat tuition and off-campus rent checks?) Students really need to think this through.
Tim, the neighbors have communicated frequently to GU about slumlords, lack of inside the gate on-campus housing, safer environments, alcohol issues and other items that are in the students best interest. Yes, I agree students and neighbors need to aline against this horrible plan that GU is setting us all up for.
It is obvious to many neighbors, GU is only looking at the profit side of the equation and on the backs of their students and the adjacent community. Students should take a much closer look what is happening to their school.
Nov 08 2009 at 4:37 p.m.
1751,
There you go, though. In your response to me, you proved my point:
"Tim, the neighbors have communicated frequently to GU about slumlords, lack of inside the gate on-campus housing, safer environments, alcohol issues and other items that are in the students best interest. Yes, I agree students and neighbors need to aline against this horrible plan that GU is setting us all up for."
By bringing up "alcohol issues," you immediately make yourselves adverse to students. No matter what you say or do, students want to have a good time. They have 4 years to spend in college, to have a bit too much to drink, and to enjoy time w/ friends. Whenever the neighbors talk about taking that away, it's a dealbreaker in terms of students supporting neighbors' point of view. The best thing that could happen for the neighborhood is for the campus to allow MORE parties (as well as housing) w/in the walls of the University. If you back off the "parties/alcohol/fun is bad" position, you'll actually find support from students who DO want to live near or on campus and not get stuck w/ slumlords.
Nov 09 2009 at 8:24 a.m.
Tim, alcohol issues is something that should be discussed openly and honestly. Seriously, GU couldn't deal with it, so they developed their current alcohol policy making their problem our (students&community) problem. I said nothing about preventing students from having a good time. If you are stating that drinking is more important to students than inside the gate housing, a safer environment, slumlords, than I guess your right we are at a no starter and it will be a lose-lose deal for everyone. Just for a second, I thought the students may recognize where this current 10 year plan is taking both the students and the community. Wishful thinking anyway. Best of luck out there.
Nov 09 2009 at 11:53 a.m.
1751,
No it will still be a win for students b/c they will continue to drink, enjoy themselves, and piss you off. But if you acknowledge and accept the fact that drinking and partying is going to happen but that you just want to relocate it, then why wouldn't you try to do that instead of fight a futile battle to stop drinking or stop students from having a good time?
Nov 09 2009 at 1:06 p.m.
Ask the students getting 61Ds if that is a win for them. I am sure comments like yours is really going to help GU with their plan- NOT. Thanks very much, that is all we need to know.
Nov 09 2009 at 3:45 p.m.
First of all, I'm not a current student, so nothing I say should be taken as representing any student position.
Second, I'm still not clear on why you wouldn't want to work with the students to allow them to enjoy themselves but to keep it close to campus? Students want to be close to campus and have fun, which involves drinking. You want students to be close to (or preferably ON) campus. What do you gain by making the drinking a rift between students and the neighborhood? If students drink in their on-campus dorm or apartment, or if they spend a night in the Tombs, what harm does it do to you? So just concede that students want to drink, agree that that's fine, and then work together to keep it on campus.
I'm just trying to find middle ground, which is something that the neighbors have not shown a willingness to do, and it's the reason for so much hostility.
Nov 09 2009 at 11:16 p.m.
Tim, Tim, Tim, What the heck are you doing? Your not a student, yet you promote unsafe and possibly illegal behavior to students that could result in serious consequences for them, yet no risk to yourself? If I was a student, I would be seriously pissed by your statements on this forum since you did represent yourself on their behalf ("non starter, just want to have fun, piss off neighbors"). You are no friend of the students or neighbors or GU. Goodbye.
Nov 10 2009 at 2:05 a.m.
I'm a very recent alum. So I consider myself much, MUCH closer to the students than the neighbors. But I at least think there might be ways to resolve these disputes so both parties are happy. You don't seem interested in that. You seem more interested in condemning what you see as "unsafe" behavior. When is the last time you were at a campus party? You have no idea how safe the vast, vast majority of them are. You just get made because they're noisy and the kids get too close to your house. I was recommending a way to get them away from you without your trying to fight the inevitably losing battle against college drinking.
But you're right about one thing. After this back and forth with you, I'm no friend of the neighbors.
Nov 10 2009 at 6:42 a.m.
1751 - You didn't purchase your nice, little Georgetown home without knowing that you were living in the SHADDOW of the University.
How did you happen to pick such a nice neighborhood. Maybe because the University is the reason your property values are so high.
And you have nothing better to do all day than blog with students so what would you do without the residents of the University?
Who would you video tape on weekend night? What would you talk about at your little community meetings? How would you fill the void of being a lonely housewife with nothing better to do than bitch about the students that you likely NEVER had the chance to be.
Go move to 'Cuse, the cold weather would be perfect for you.
Nov 11 2009 at 9:20 a.m.
Insults, harassment and attempts at intimidation without is a strong indication your argument is weak. As you grow older you will learn this. I will save my arguments for those that have matured enough and can use their brain in a more productive manner. My attempt was only to help students realize what the 10 year plan is setting them up for. 1789 is correct this forum is a waste of my time. Best of luck.